My recent trip to Ukraine was interesting. One thing that I found interesting was how anti-Russian the Ukrainians were. Aren’t they brother and sister? Well, yes they are though to Ukraine’s defense the big brother has often acted horribly toward its younger sibling. Anti-Russian, anti-communist and anti-Stalin sentiment is at least understandable from a Ukrainian point of view. What is not understandable was their sympathy for the Nazi Third Reich. I found a very “If only” attitude toward Hitler and the Nazis regarding the outcome of the second World War. According to a Ukrainian friend of mine, this new mindset has emerged only after the “Revolution of Dignity” in 2014.
As I pointed out, my trip involved a two day excursion to Poland in where we stayed with a distant relative. As I also pointed out in a previous post, Poland is an extremely Catholic country. I also pointed out that the Ukraine was a very secular country. I talked to a Ukrainian friend from Zaporizhia when I returned from my trip and she told me that only 3% or Ukrainians and Russians attend Church every Sunday. Although she didn’t cite a source, it was certainly consistent with my observations while in Ukraine.
So we have the deeply Christian Poland and the deeply non-Christian pro-Nazi Ukraine. It was only a few months ago that Poland implemented a law restricting free speech on saying that there were Polish death camps and that Poland as a nation was responsible for the holocaust. The President of Poland specifically said that this would not apply to saying that individual Poles collaborated with the Nazis. None of this was good enough for the state of Israel who raised a big stink over this.
I think that this showed extremely poor character on the part of Israel. Millions of Jewish and Catholic Poles were killed in the war because of the occupying German army. Not a single Israeli died in the war because the country wouldn’t come into existence for several more years. Yet, Israel has the audacity to tell Poland that this law is wrong. Again, very poor character on their part. The most laughable argument made by Jews(and in the above video) is that after the war, some remaining Polish Jews returned home and were persecuted by the local Polish population. If something happened after the war then it wasn’t the holocaust as the holocaust happened during the war. This lack of logic is astounding.
Why are Israelis mad at Poland, but not mad at Ukraine which has an actual pro-Nazi government? This is because I believe that most Jews hate Christianity more than Nazism. It puzzles them that the greatest crime ever committed against the Jews wasn’t by Christianity. Germany in the 20th century was very secular, but the same thing can’t be said about Poland. If Poland can take a share of the responsibility for the holocaust, then it’s partially a Christian crime which most Jews would like to believe. They need this to fit the bogus narrative that the Church has butchered Jews for 2,000 years which is a complete lie. The Church has always protected Jews. Jews are lied to by their community leaders and rabbis about this and grow up hating Christianity because of it.
Poland was a victim of World War II. As a nation they aren’t responsible for the holocaust. Why are the Jews hating Christianity more than Nazism? All I can think of is the criticism that Jesus made of the Jews in Matthew 23 and John 8. Dr. E. Michael Jones is certainly correct that rejecting the divine Logos has consequences. Nazism over Christianity; very sad.
you seem to be pretty willing to have nuanced opinions on Islam and Muslims which is laudable, but have this weird over generalizing attitude towards Jews. I’m not really sure how you could prove this claim, but I guarantee you Jews really don’t care if they see someone walk by with a cross necklace or a priest’s collar day to day. If they see someone with a swastika tat its probably a different story. I don’t imagine they like Christianity much, but considering most Jews aren’t even religious and don’t even really understand their own religion they probably don’t either with Christianity. I’m sure even israelis didn’t care about poland and it was just politicians there who made a thing about it. Do Americans hate Yemen because our government helps provide saudi with rockets? No, most don’t even know anything about it or have no opinion on it.
Hi Norcal,
You said: “but have this weird over generalizing attitude towards Jews.” I was careful to say most and not all.
I would recommending watching Youtube videos given by Jewish leaders to exclusively Jewish audiences, or reading Jewish literature by Jewish leaders intended for a Jewish audience only.
God bless,
Allan
That is a distinctive difference, but its still a broad generalization.
Ok I’ll try to watch some youtube videos. I’m sure there is plenty of hatred of Christianity in them (I’ve seen the stuff in the talmud about Jesus and crazy quotes from rabbis) all Im saying is I think it’s doubtful that this applies to the average jew and frankly not many of them because its rather extreme.
“This is because I believe that most Jews hate Christianity more than Nazism.”
I am a Canadian Jew. This is an old article, but where on earth, might I ask, do you get such a preposterous idea?
Hello Josh,
Thanks for the response. Most Jews believe that the church has butchered them for 2,000 years because they haven’t believed in Jesus Christ which is a huge lie. They think the inquisition was the murder of Jews because they didn’t believe in Jesus when it was actually Jews pretending to believe in Jesus when they didn’t. I could bring up other examples.
Many Jews also believe that Nazism was a Christian phenomenon. That Hitler and all the Nazis were weekly church goers and prayed the rosary every evening. The truth is, if the Church wanted all Jews dead, it could have done so in 13th century when the Pope had an unlimited amount of power.
Now I did say most Jews, certainly not all. It sounds like you’re a thinker and haven’t caved into that narrative so God bless you for that.
Feel free to comment on here anytime. I discuss Judaism quite a bit.
God bless,
Allan
Hi Allan,
As Norcal points out, it’s a profound overgeneralization. I’d be amazed if you managed to find any Jew who professes to dislike Christianity more than Nazism. Can you suggest an example from “Jewish literature by Jewish leaders intended for a Jewish audience only” which gives you this impression?
As for the Church and butchering Jews, I’d imagine that most Jews who really know their history know that examples of the Church directly butchering Jews are rare and limited mostly to the Crusades. Other persecution, however, was widespread, and Nazi persecutions shared deep affinities with those kinds of persecution. In one of Hitler’s first meetings with Catholic clergy (Osnabruck, 1933), he had the following to say. He was met, famously, with silent agreement. This is discussed moderately here by the Catholic philosopher Martin Rhonheimer (https://www.firstthings.com/article/2003/11/the-holocaust-what-was-not-said):
“I have been attacked because of my handling of the Jewish question. The Catholic Church considered the Jews pestilent for fifteen hundred years, put them in ghettos, etc., because it recognized the Jews for what they were. In the epoch of liberalism the danger was no longer recognized. I am moving back toward the time in which a fifteen-hundred-year-long tradition was implemented. I do not set race over religion, but I recognize the representatives of this race as pestilent for the state and for the Church, and perhaps I am thereby doing Christianity a great service by pushing them out of schools and public functions.”
Hitler saw himself within a long Christian European tradition of marginalizing and persecuting Jews socially and economically, long before he turned to extermination. This is the primary sense in which Jews might consider Christianity to be “at fault” for the Holocaust, though I would never put it that way myself. No intelligent Jew would call the Holocaust a Christian phenomenon; no doubt it was a fundamentally secular one. But it would disingenuous to suggest it wasn’t easier to make people accede to hatred and persecution of Jews when they’d already been doing it for 1500 years under the auspices of another long-standing European power. It is therefore natural that Jews would not look upon the Church’s record favourably. But this is very far from “hating Christianity more than Nazism”. You have made this accusation without a scintilla of evidence from Jewish literature or public statements. I would appeal for some moderation in your writing.
Josh
Hello Josh,
You point out a lot and I’m in a bit of a hurry so I’ll respond to a couple things that stand out.
“Hitler saw himself within a long Christian European tradition of marginalizing and persecuting Jews socially and economically, long before he turned to extermination. ”
I think you give the answer without realizing it. The holocaust wasn’t putting Jews in ghettos or making them wear a star on their clothing. It was extermination. You can say the Church marginalized them in ghettos to a certain extent but exterminating Jews was not on their list. It was on the Nazi list though.
“No intelligent Jew would call the Holocaust a Christian phenomenon; no doubt it was a fundamentally secular one.”
I agree, no intelligent Jew would call it a Christian phenomenon.
I may respond to more later but I’m in a hurry.
God bless,
Allan
Evening Allan,
Unless you can provide some evidence that “most Jews” regard Nazi extermination as a Christian phenomenon, you are attacking a very mysterious straw man, and certainly one that I’ve never met. Arguments made by Jews with regards to Catholicism and the Holocaust nearly always allege a pretty reasonable level of “complicity”, if you could call it that, and that is that centuries of persecution and hateful rhetoric from the Church created a vast reservoir of antisemitism which made Europe fertile ground for antisemitic movements, Nazism included. This is something mainstream Catholicism has taken responsibility for, and I am myself really glad that Jewish-Catholic are at an all-time high as a result of this breakthrough, among others. I have met few Jews who express any ill will to Christianity per se; historical resentments in my experience are directed at institutions and individuals rather than religions.
But you represent a particularly nostalgic brand of Catholicism, so let me ask you this. You presumably follow “Dr. Jones” in regarding Western society as “overridden by an operating system or by software that you would call ‘The Jews.’” Hitler apparently agreed, of course, but that’s besides the point. So suppose Church theocracy were restored, as you’d like it, and you had your way. Jones says modernity is Jewish, so presumably we’re far more pernicious now than we were in pre-modernity. What happens to us? Which Church persecutions would you like to restore? Just make sure our ghetto’s in Banff, I beseech thee. 😉
Josh
Well, I haven’t talked to “most Jews”. This is based on Jews I’ve interacted with so it’s an educated guess.
“Which Church persecutions would you like to restore? Just make sure our ghetto’s in Banff, I beseech thee. ”
I would simply ban all usury and pornography and anyone who engages in it, Jew or gentile, goes to jail.
God bless,
Allan
Well you’d better clear a lot of jail space, buddy.
“Well, I haven’t talked to “most Jews”. This is based on Jews I’ve interacted with so it’s an educated guess.”
Yes, that’s a great sample size. Certainly sufficient for you to be enlightening your readers on the thoughts of some 20 million people. I myself have some humility, so I’d hesitate to ascribe any thoughts to “most Catholics”. But what I can say is that with Catholics of your persuasion, there is little distinction between Nazism and the sort of antisemitism you promote. In that sense, and in that sense only, these “most Jews” you have been talking to are correct.
Would you agree with E. Michael Jones’ statement? Note the extensive similarities with Nazi literature and ideology. He wrote a book on the “Jewish science” (a Nazi phrase) of Heisenberg and the “Jewish sexualization” of Weimar culture. These were Nazi allegations. He has written extensive endorsements of the Judeo-Bolshevism conspiracy, used by the Nazis, as I’m sure you know, as justification for Operation Barbarossa and the Generalplan Ost. Do you deny these similarities? Why do you think such similarities would be lost on Jews who know their history? These are the sorts of parallels people see when they talk about Nazis and certain Christians. If I were to write that Western society is “overridden by an operating system or by software that you would call ‘The Christians””, you likely wouldn’t hesitate (rightly, of course) in calling me anti-Christian. So why is it you’d hesitate to identify the original statement as antisemitism? It’s no different than how the Nazis saw things. This is what people are talking about here!
Try for some honesty for once. Why don’t you tell me (and your readers) what it is you truly believe in? That would be much preferable to slandering groups of people for holding beliefs that they don’t.
“But what I can say is that with Catholics of your persuasion, there is little distinction between Nazism and the sort of antisemitism you promote.”
I’m going to have to ask you to retract this remark and apologize. If you don’t I will cease to publish any further comments from you.
Josh,
I received your message and I won’t post it for a myriad of reasons. You obviously can’t behave online. Come back when you learn how to behave and we can have a civil discussion.
God bless,
Allan